Hello all TGB lovers.

So far I know/learn, these brake drum seals (Volvo ref 1562892) are not manufactured and are not in stock anymore at Volvo dealers (except dusty forgotten bags).

I had a small discussion with some members of this really helpful forum.
So …
Here is my little project : Making a "replica" production !!!

Of course needs investing into a new master injection module.
Investigations started today with some rubber specialists in Europe.
I now consider to make a small serie of 200 or 300 seals (or more).
Price/unit would be in the 50-80 Euros area, to be confirmed after final quotations check. I wish to keep it closer to 50 than 80 !!!!
Delivery worldwide.
Possible discount like 10% for quantities above 10 pieces (or more for high quantities), and I can also consider discount for pre-order before production.
I am not a retail company or whatsoever, it is not my core business (despite I am a mechanic working in the automotive area), and I don't expect to earn thousands of Euros out of this.
As technical meetings only started this April, 2014, there will not be any production before 2 months at least.

My poll (answers and comments are welcome here or privately) :
1. Would you be interested in buying these "replica" seals ?
2. Do you know how much costs one original seal at Volvo (I don't) ?
3. Do you think a price range of 50-80 Euros/seal is acceptable ?

For information, check this thread :
http://www.c303.de/c303-forum/index.php?board=12;action=display;threadid=11389

I hope this post will raise some interest among all of you !!!
 

Zitat von: Luuk am 10.April 2014 19:45:8

The original seal was about 27 euros as far as I can remember.

Thanks.
Far cheaper than the price mentioned in the link above (110 Euros !!!).
Or I misunderstood the sentence (and the translation !!).

I tried to get the price from the Volvo truck dealer but still waiting.
Maybe no price available as it is not sold anymore ...

Zitat von: johnnyk am 10.April 2014 23:50:25

I would not use EU 110 as the base for your price justification.  Yea the C202 jp posted as cost price was EU110 .    We negotiated on far better price. I bought the 4 off him. The original Volvo Truck price was EU27 +19%tax as verified by other forum members.

Thanks Johnny !!
This makes original part price at an averaged 33 Euros with taxes (it varies within EU).
I am sure everyone can understand costs ok making a replica with new forming tools and low production volume (as 200-300 units can be).
And part of C30x owners are switching to disc brakes ...

Well, let's check the quotations and the prices.
The boss of one of the companies is a car's enthusiast and already make rubber seals replicas for oldtimers (cars and motorbikes), I am sure the quality will be OK.
I could get cheaper quotations in eastern Europe or China, but what about quality ?

By the way : are there North Europe members here ?
I would ask Swedish, Danish, Finnish, etc ... people if they could be interested as well.
But I can't handle their language at Offipalsta forum for example.
Any Far North people here to guide me ?

Zitat von: johnnyk am 11.April 2014 07:39:47

No Problems!!!    I am sure the members appreciate your efforts. But before jumping in and committing your associate to a small scale production of drum seals I would speak to Jochen (rijo) as he has a source of spare parts. He may have some old stock of Drumseals or a small production run organised already.

Yes, I spoke to Jochen recently and we discussed a little bit about these seals.
He has no stock.
He also looked to remanufacture these seals but his project is in stand-by due to cost of master model.
Of course I don't want to do it in parallel with him, I'll keep him informed.

Zitat von: Luuk am 14.April 2014 05:52:58

If someone is looking for a seal as a model, i've a couple of them at home still in their original package.

Hi Luuk.
Thanks a lot for your proposal.
I removed the "less damaged" seal from a brake drum, and I probably go back to the factory on wednesday.
If they would have an original seal, I'll tell them.
Of course they won't make any test to the seal, but measure the original shape.
I'll keep you informed.

Zitat von: abce am 14.April 2014 09:37:46

Hello I have interest in the seals too and I also have access to the original drawings at Volvo. The problem is that I can’t copy the drawing and give you but I can look at it and tell you what seal should look like. I’m on vacation this week but next week will I be back at work and can check the drawing. Anders

Thanks Anders.
Yes it would be the best.
I am now in contact with Trelleborg, which could be the original manufacturer, but first contact is not so good, the don't find anything related to what was written on the seal ... maybe too old (or contact person is too young ?). He told me Trelleborg never manufactured anything for Volvo, which looks very uncertain. Maybe the wrong department, too ....

Zitat von: johnnyk am 12.Juni 2014 10:29:7

Any progress on the Drum seals?

Some ...
I got the prices for 2 type of molds.
One version without the "bullets", the other one (more expensive) with.
Of course the only way "not to kill my wallet" is the produce several hundreds od seals and add a small % of the mold to the seal price.
How long would it take to sell enough seals and to be at least in balance ... that's the question ...
I have one good opportunity for that, but both parties must decide the best way to achieve it (this is a serious guy and we have good contacts).

I wait for a new seal (kindly temporary sent by a member of this forum) to take dimensions of an unpacked and unfitted unit.

I also have other opportunities to make new seals, but it does not belong to me to get the right informations/tooling. So I must be patient.

No reply from "abce" about his above post ....
If anybody knows a way to contact him (I tried by PM him but no reply yet), it would be nice.

I just wonder what is the purpose of the bullets ...
Does anyone know exactly why they are there ?
 

Well ..

This is a great idea !!!!!
 

Thanks a lot for this valuable information !!!
OK, I'll forget about the "no-bullet" seal to respect the Volvo design.

Waiting for abce's reading …
 

Thanks a lot, abce !!!

A forum member kindly checked his new still-packed seal, it shows the reference 1561851 on it (not the Volvo part number) which is same as on my old seal.



Both his and my seals have protruding bullets, without any small lead balls.



This is the picture of the previous-sold-here seals :



What I am thinking now, is that these pictures show the last version of the seal with rubber bullets instead of cavities filled with removable lead balls. This could be due to environmental laws forcing lead to be banned from use (like asbestos in brakes).

So ….
I need as much details as possible for the latest version … 

Sorry if everybody already knows about different seals versions, I'm a newbie here, learning history of our beloved machines !!!

Hi johnnyk.

As said, I am still learning every day.
I noted the air vent piping, originally assuming (without further consideration) that it was an air vent, not an air pressure line. Clever idea again. All of my 4 brakes do not show dirt inside, even with old cracked rubber bullets seals. Of course I don't know the history of the vehicle, and its off road usage (or not).

I would know the reason of the rubber bullets seal version …
I guess only Volvo, or well-documented people, could give an answer.

So, here is a poll to this forum members : would you tell us if your brake drum seals are lead balls type, or rubber bullets type ?

OK …
I have to apologize again … 

After deep cleaning, I realized that … my old seal has lead balls, too.
Shame on me …

I also got the new seal for a few days (thanks, buddy !!), and it has lead balls too.
Only one type of seal, then. Hopefully, finally.

The bad news : I am afraid that the price of the mold will go up a lot, due to additional complexity for lead ball cavity. More info in the next weeks.
The good news : It is easy to remove the lead balls from the old seal and place them back. So there is no need of buying balls separately.

I still have an opportunity to make it a lot easier, but it depends on other people's good will, and it's totally out of my control. The go-no go decision can only be taken after clarifying this opportunity.

Thanks for all informations shared here !!!

Lead ball is 4 mm diameter.

124 balls per seal.

Zitat von: zulphur am 13.März 2019 12:51:32

Yes, I believe that reproduction could end up being cheaper

Well ...
For the story ...
We were close to get an agreement to use the original mold at a belgian rubber injection company.
A price estimation was made for a production of 1000 to 2000 seals.
A visit of Tatanka was almost planned.
But for unclear reason(s), Tatanka cancelled the visit.
It might be due to lead balls availability and installation work ...
I don't know ...
Finally Tatanka decided to make injection in another country, where the seal AND the balls were probably assembled ... maybe ...

I understand that for private use, it is not important if you have to spend one evening removing the lead balls from the old seal, and insert them in the new seal.
But for hundreds of seals, it becomes quite boring (not counting that lead is not environment-friendly anymore).
That was my original plan if I decided to make seals on my side (by 200 units) : to sell seals without balls, at a fair price. But mold building costs was huge (even if I got the original drawings for the seal). And I didn't want to pay thousands of euros plus another thousands of euros for first seals without knowing the return on investment.

A lot of axles are now used for heavy offload races using brake discs.
I even saw a east european company machining axle hubs holders and other parts out of aluminium block with CNC machines !!!

So now I'm also switching (very slowly) to brake discs ...

Well, rebuild project is on standby now ...

I found approaching V-shaped seals at Eriks webshop, but of course without lead balls possibilities.
Volvo portals are common in asian countries for extreme offroad races, but never using original drums. Maybe they kept original drums and seals somewhere, but I believe seals lips are cracked, too ...