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  27.März 2019 02:00:00

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 Thema: NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892  (Gelesen 4459 mal)
macfun

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NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 09.April 2014 17:20:46 »
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Hello all TGB lovers.

So far I know/learn, these brake drum seals (Volvo ref 1562892) are not manufactured and are not in stock anymore at Volvo dealers (except dusty forgotten bags).

I had a small discussion with some members of this really helpful forum.
So …
Here is my little project : Making a "replica" production !!!

Of course needs investing into a new master injection module.
Investigations started today with some rubber specialists in Europe.
I now consider to make a small serie of 200 or 300 seals (or more).
Price/unit would be in the 50-80 Euros area, to be confirmed after final quotations check. I wish to keep it closer to 50 than 80 !!!!
Delivery worldwide.
Possible discount like 10% for quantities above 10 pieces (or more for high quantities), and I can also consider discount for pre-order before production.
I am not a retail company or whatsoever, it is not my core business (despite I am a mechanic working in the automotive area), and I don't expect to earn thousands of Euros out of this.
As technical meetings only started this April, 2014, there will not be any production before 2 months at least.

My poll (answers and comments are welcome here or privately) :
1. Would you be interested in buying these "replica" seals ?
2. Do you know how much costs one original seal at Volvo (I don't) ?
3. Do you think a price range of 50-80 Euros/seal is acceptable ?

For information, check this thread :
http://www.c303.de/c303-forum/index.php?board=12;action=display;threadid=11389

I hope this post will raise some interest among all of you !!!
  smiley
C303 and Mercedes 280GE
« Letzte Änderung: 09.April 2014 17:21:09 von macfun » Moderator benachrichtigen   Gespeichert
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 10.April 2014 02:12:31 »
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I would like to register my interest. I have need for 2 more seals.  smiley 
johnny
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 10.April 2014 21:45:08 »
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The original seal was about 27 euros as far as I can remember.
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 10.April 2014 23:06:32 »
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Zitat von: Luuk am 10.April 2014 21:45:08
The original seal was about 27 euros as far as I can remember.

Thanks.
Far cheaper than the price mentioned in the link above (110 Euros !!!).
Or I misunderstood the sentence (and the translation !!).

I tried to get the price from the Volvo truck dealer but still waiting.
Maybe no price available as it is not sold anymore ...
C303 and Mercedes 280GE
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 11.April 2014 01:50:25 »
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I would not use EU 110 as the base for your price justification.  Yea the C202 jp posted as cost price was EU110 .  wink  We negotiated on far better price. I bought the 4 off him. The original Volvo Truck price was EU27 +19%tax as verified by other forum members.  grin
johnny
« Letzte Änderung: 11.April 2014 01:57:35 von johnnyk » Moderator benachrichtigen   Gespeichert
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 11.April 2014 07:48:50 »
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Zitat von: johnnyk am 11.April 2014 01:50:25
I would not use EU 110 as the base for your price justification.  Yea the C202 jp posted as cost price was EU110 .  wink  We negotiated on far better price. I bought the 4 off him. The original Volvo Truck price was EU27 +19%tax as verified by other forum members.  grin

Thanks Johnny !!
This makes original part price at an averaged 33 Euros with taxes (it varies within EU).
I am sure everyone can understand costs ok making a replica with new forming tools and low production volume (as 200-300 units can be).
And part of C30x owners are switching to disc brakes ...

Well, let's check the quotations and the prices.
The boss of one of the companies is a car's enthusiast and already make rubber seals replicas for oldtimers (cars and motorbikes), I am sure the quality will be OK.
I could get cheaper quotations in eastern Europe or China, but what about quality ?

By the way : are there North Europe members here ?
I would ask Swedish, Danish, Finnish, etc ... people if they could be interested as well.
But I can't handle their language at Offipalsta forum for example.
Any Far North people here to guide me ?
C303 and Mercedes 280GE
« Letzte Änderung: 11.April 2014 07:54:06 von macfun » Moderator benachrichtigen   Gespeichert
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 11.April 2014 09:39:47 »
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No Problems!!!  grin  I am sure the members appreciate your efforts. But before jumping in and committing your associate to a small scale production of drum seals I would speak to Jochen (rijo) as he has a source of spare parts. He may have some old stock of Drumseals or a small production run organised already.
You have to also account for the complexity of the seal lip. On the edge it has pockets to hold lead shot for centifugal operation.
I just had a funny thought- someone dismantling a shotgun cartridge to remove the lead shot to fit in drumseal lip.  wink   

For my my thoughts if the cost of seals are between Eu50-Eu70 I would purchase them if they were of European quality and you can make some money out of venture.  Chinese made would be suspect in such a low volume production.  I also have 2 local associates that would be interested in a complete set of seals.  cheesy 
I believe there are far north members as far as Finland and Russia.
   
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 11.April 2014 09:48:17 »
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Zitat von: johnnyk am 11.April 2014 09:39:47
No Problems!!!  grin  I am sure the members appreciate your efforts. But before jumping in and committing your associate to a small scale production of drum seals I would speak to Jochen (rijo) as he has a source of spare parts. He may have some old stock of Drumseals or a small production run organised already.   

Yes, I spoke to Jochen recently and we discussed a little bit about these seals.
He has no stock.
He also looked to remanufacture these seals but his project is in stand-by due to cost of master model.
Of course I don't want to do it in parallel with him, I'll keep him informed.
C303 and Mercedes 280GE
« Letzte Änderung: 11.April 2014 09:48:56 von macfun » Moderator benachrichtigen   Gespeichert
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 14.April 2014 07:52:58 »
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If someone is looking for a seal as a model, i've a couple of them at home still in their original package.
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 14.April 2014 08:24:04 »
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Zitat von: Luuk am 14.April 2014 07:52:58
If someone is looking for a seal as a model, i've a couple of them at home still in their original package.

Hi Luuk.
Thanks a lot for your proposal.
I removed the "less damaged" seal from a brake drum, and I probably go back to the factory on wednesday.
If they would have an original seal, I'll tell them.
Of course they won't make any test to the seal, but measure the original shape.
I'll keep you informed.
C303 and Mercedes 280GE
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 14.April 2014 11:37:46 »
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Hello

I have interest in the seals too and I also have access to the original drawings at Volvo. The problem is that I can’t copy the drawing and give you but I can look at it and tell you what seal should look like. I’m on vacation this week but next week will I be back at work and can check the drawing.

Anders
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 15.April 2014 10:30:48 »
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Zitat von: abce am 14.April 2014 11:37:46
Hello

I have interest in the seals too and I also have access to the original drawings at Volvo. The problem is that I can’t copy the drawing and give you but I can look at it and tell you what seal should look like. I’m on vacation this week but next week will I be back at work and can check the drawing.
Anders

Thanks Anders.
Yes it would be the best.
I am now in contact with Trelleborg, which could be the original manufacturer, but first contact is not so good, the don't find anything related to what was written on the seal ... maybe too old (or contact person is too young ?). He told me Trelleborg never manufactured anything for Volvo, which looks very uncertain. Maybe the wrong department, too ....


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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 12.Juni 2014 12:29:07 »
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Any progress on the Drum seals?
johnny
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 12.Juni 2014 14:08:24 »
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Zitat von: johnnyk am 12.Juni 2014 12:29:07
Any progress on the Drum seals?

Some ...
I got the prices for 2 type of molds.
One version without the "bullets", the other one (more expensive) with.
Of course the only way "not to kill my wallet" is the produce several hundreds od seals and add a small % of the mold to the seal price.
How long would it take to sell enough seals and to be at least in balance ... that's the question ...
I have one good opportunity for that, but both parties must decide the best way to achieve it (this is a serious guy and we have good contacts).

I wait for a new seal (kindly temporary sent by a member of this forum) to take dimensions of an unpacked and unfitted unit.

I also have other opportunities to make new seals, but it does not belong to me to get the right informations/tooling. So I must be patient.

No reply from "abce" about his above post ....
If anybody knows a way to contact him (I tried by PM him but no reply yet), it would be nice.

I just wonder what is the purpose of the bullets ...
Does anyone know exactly why they are there ?
  huh
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 12.Juni 2014 16:55:45 »
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Sure.
The idea is to lift the sealing at higher wheel rotation.
The sealings are supposed to seal at low speed only when digging in the dirt.
At higher speed ( driving on normal road) the centrifugal force lift it up to avoid wear and it also saves some fuel I suppose.

Regards.
Rickard
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...geht auch ohne Volvo; macht aber keinen Spaß

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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 12.Juni 2014 16:56:17 »
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... you need the bullet as weight. So the seal flys away from the Brakeplate at high speeds. Otherwise the rubber would touch it and ....

so das wars jetzt mit meinem englisch    rolleyes

Bei hohen Geschwindigkeiten sorgen die Bleikugeln dafür, dass die Dichtung nicht mehr an der Bremsankerplatte reibt. Sonst wäre die Dichtung gleich wieder durch.

Grüße
Uli
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 12.Juni 2014 18:02:24 »
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The idea is to lift the sealing at higher wheel rotation.
The sealings are supposed to seal at low speed only when digging in the dirt.
At higher speed ( driving on normal road) the centrifugal force will lift the bullets and consequently the sealing up to avoid wear and it also saves some fuel I suppose.

Btw: abce will check his messages. I called him.

Regards.
Rickard
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 12.Juni 2014 20:01:56 »
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Well ..

This is a great idea !!!!!
  tongue

Thanks a lot for this valuable information !!!
OK, I'll forget about the "no-bullet" seal to respect the Volvo design.

Waiting for abce's reading …
  cool
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 13.Juni 2014 20:38:58 »
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Hej

The main reason of lifting the seal is to ventilate the brakes when on the road.

Yes I have sent a PM to McFun. I’m bad at reading this Forum now since it’s now four years I left Germany.

Anders
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Re:NEUE Dichtung Bremstrommel - New Brake Drum Seal ref 1562892
« am: 13.Juni 2014 22:16:08 »
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Thanks a lot, abce !!!

A forum member kindly checked his new still-packed seal, it shows the reference 1561851 on it (not the Volvo part number) which is same as on my old seal.



Both his and my seals have protruding bullets, without any small lead balls.



This is the picture of the previous-sold-here seals :



What I am thinking now, is that these pictures show the last version of the seal with rubber bullets instead of cavities filled with removable lead balls. This could be due to environmental laws forcing lead to be banned from use (like asbestos in brakes).

So ….
I need as much details as possible for the latest version …  grin

Sorry if everybody already knows about different seals versions, I'm a newbie here, learning history of our beloved machines !!!
C303 and Mercedes 280GE
« Letzte Änderung: 25.Juni 2018 16:03:27 von macfun » Moderator benachrichtigen   Gespeichert
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